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I’m not sure how many were ripped from vinyl, and the vinyl noise on that one track is on the track and pretty loud on the track – that’s from a CD. 🙂 No stereo/width processing was done. Any perceived stereo enhancement is strictly a byproduct of the dynamics processing.
My needles are mostly Ortofon, my favorite being a new old-stock Ortofon X3-MC that was hand picked for me by them. FANTASTIC balanced and neutral needle, without sounding stale or boring. It’s tipped with one of the best diamonds they’ve ever had, so it’s no slouch on details, while also having very low surface noise. Basically a reference dream cartridge, on the "cheap".
What I think is of course that should be done. Simple fact tho, is even comparing that way, you’re just comparing specific settings in each of the boxes, and it’s the manufacturers that don’t want to play that game. Some maybe don’t want to compete on fair ground too, but the 1st "issue" makes for a convenient excuse.
Leif has given away MPX Tool licenses to manufacturers before who said they would submit their own MPX of the Torture Test, and they never actually did send anything in return. 😐
It’ll most likely have to be done by someone who owns one of those.
It would be nice to hear a well tuned Vorsis AP2000 and/or Air setup… on the Torture Test. MPX output please. There really isn’t any other way to accurately compare the output of different processors.
The AP2000 clip from Processing Freak Day in Netherlands is basically a joke, as the salepeople and whatever tech they sent (if they sent one) were fussing with the box trying to "beat" Breakaway by switching presets etc… and the box they had clearly had problems with its mono detection algorithms.
mpxtool.com if anyone wants to upload it. 😉
[quote author=”Roygbiv”]I think input low pass is very good option, because last band in multiband is high pass filter, so if I want only 20-15000Hz then 15000-21000Hz may reduce gain of this last band and produce not optimal output sound.[/quote]
It’s always possible, but in the grand scheme of things… the vast majority of tracks sound much more natural when the whole signal is processed up until the final peak limiting, and when the low-pass setting doesn’t effect the intended sound of the preset.
Basically I’m just repeating myself tho. 😆
[quote author=”Roygbiv”]Helo
In Breakaway Block Diagram is bug, low pass filter is not after high pass, but is after multiband procesor, I tested it. I don’t understand this idea, because it is very very important tu put low pass direct input to process only target range of audio signal in muliband compressors and limiters.[/quote]
You’re right about the diagram being wrong.
The low-pass is after for a good reason though. For instance; with the low-pass before the multiband, if you have a top band that only has say 2kHz of bandwidth running through it… it’s likely the high-end will sound too dense because that band’s AGC will be way higher than normal, and the limiter will still see the same height of peaks… so it’ll end up making the treble way too dense. (you have probably heard this in certain other processors).
With the low-pass after the multiband, you get a naturally processed high frequency sound that’s consistent to what the preset (or you own settings, with the hardware box) were designed for… and the sound of the treble won’t change when you adjust the low-pass.
– – –
The bass on the other hand, you do want the high-pass to be right away since there’s wide-band dynamics directly after that, which while… they do have sidechains that avoid very low bass "thud" type problems, it is designed to be effected somewhat. So that’s a nice option to allow people to filter out actual audio that they may be having through with, and also to the benefit of the wideband dynamics within.
[quote author=”Q106″]Jesse,U showed your trump card too early.I stand by my post.A joint R&D with the processing guru,Mr. Foti.Hey,who could blame you.Let the ass kicking begin.Good luck to you guys.[/quote]
I’ve talked with Frank, Bob, Camille, Gregg, Scott, etc, etc… before I ever knew Leif about 4 years ago. Leif already had boxes out with Linear Acoustic for twice as long as that, a Telos company. So Frank having a copy of Breakaway software that the public doesn’t have is a trump card? Whatever you say. 🙂And yeah MPX Tool comes with the Omnia.11. I don’t see how I’m suddenly giving you new information here. As I said, the scene doesn’t have enemies, people enjoy sharing their work with each other, and also work with each other from time to time.
Leif used to work AT Orban too btw. "OMG OMG The Breakaway hardware is going to be an Orban, right?" 😉 Speculate all you want.
[quote author=”Q106″]So is the new hardware version a joint venture with Omnia??[/quote]
The audio processing scene in some ways has many secrets, many are well protected. It’s also very tightly knit, and nobody is an enemy of anyone else. We all have the same love, and we all like to share things sometimes. Frank does have a version of Breakaway that can load presets, obviously. Anything more is just speculation. Just wait and see what happens. 8)[quote author=”Q106″]Collusion?? Sounds like Frank is involved on this new project.Maybe they will call it "Omnia 11 JR…What cha" think??[/quote]
See above comment.[quote author=”Ivo”]This sounds as the ultimate processor for public stations! Compression you almost can’t hear, leaving the basics in material untouched, and so good for many formats. And what about noise reduction? Will it be available?[/quote]
The downward expander (aka noise reduction) is in it, and very well tuned and active. Calibrated for a -20dB LKFS input. But the new framework will most likely be going for an EBU R128 standard as far as input metering… basically -23dB LKFS, with -1dB maximum TruePeak (4x oversampled inter-sample detection)
[quote author=”Ivo”]As almost everybody (including me) is curious about this preset, is there a possibility we can hear something from it in advance? Maby you can publish a short compilation of materials on the website 🙂 ? I would appriciate, ’cause I’d love to hear![/quote]
I’m planning to render and upload my 3.5 hour processing demo from last year, processed with it. And another new preset too, when it’s ready. It’s not so much a torture test, but it’s very enjoyable to listen to (musically) and it does have some drastically differing material. With 3.5 hours, you get a good idea of what it could sound like on air across a bunch of genres.
[quote author=”Ivo”]I listened the files – however some links-pages doesn’t exist any longer – and they sound nice and clean. Especially ‘science – my edit – Passive Aggressive.wav’. Very good but I’m not totally convinced yet. Just because I didn’t heard the original.[/quote]
That’s taken from original CD pressing, so at least from that era to most new "remasters" you get a nice increase in dynamic range. The mp3s are missing because my stupid web host ran a script that deleted ALL mp3s from my website, without bothering to look at the usage to see that I wasn’t hosting them publicly OR using it for a backup service. PowWeb is who it was btw, and after my year contract is up, I’m leaving them after almost 7 years. What a pisser eh?
[quote author=”Ivo”]Let me explain. In my opinion this is really important because if your source isn’t sounding well, you just can’t make it better using a sound processor. Not even with the most expensive one. If you fried your potatoes, you can’t turn that back either (I hope this comparison make sense and you know what I mean).[/quote]
Passive Aggressor does very very good with over-processed and generally already ruined/destroyed audio. You’ll notice when stuff is very slammed, the output level will peak at like -3dB or less even. There has to be some headroom there for everything to be the right loudness.
[quote author=”Ivo”]But as Jesse said before ‘it sounds open’ I totally agree so far. Still I can’t wait to hear more of it!My remaining question @Jesse »» will ‘NR’ be available on this preset? And if so, how will it act? Based on speech, or music? (I mean with music there have to be a much higher treshold before ‘gettin’ in’).[/quote]
It’s more relaxed than what you heard in those demos. It also has a few tweaks to eliminate potentially distortion generating timings that are there with "Reference" or "50" settings for the attack/release in there. That info has also been passed along to Leif btw.[quote author=”sgeirk”]As far as I know, Noise Reduction is not dependent upon the preset to be functional or not. It’s separate. It’s your choice at any time with any preset.[/quote]
It’s not separate. It’s your choice to enable it or not, but the downward expander settings are part of the preset, so that the level and "action" of the noise reduction can match whatever the preset requires, or doesn’t.[quote author=”camclone”]I have not tested the BBP version[/quote]
Which "flavor" and exact version did you test this on? What OS and CPU?[quote author=”camclone”]Only when in high latecy mode ( i am not 100& sure)[/quote]
Can you do some testing on your problem machine then, to see if that is really true?If it is, I’ll make sure Leif knows about it.
[quote author=”camclone”]Greek Music and Bolywood music …needs that new preset too 🙂)[/quote]
It’s not a processed sounding preset at all. You probably won’t like it for your FM. But you might love it at home. I dunno. It is what it is. 8)[quote author=”Ivo”]An open preset, easy to listen to, but with a density you dream about. The last thing means a better mask of the noise in talking s/n ratio, which means a few km’s/miles more range of the fm-transmitter. Those factors seem to me like a very complicated combination[/quote]
The way it works is based on the pre-existing density of the music. It’s not a high density sound tho. It’s a very unprocessed sound. It won’t make a dynamic song sound crushed, and it won’t make a crushed song sound dynamic. But it will make the spectral balance and loudness always "just right" regardless, and that’s the innovation with it.It’s doing stuff that I don’t think any other processing could do, and each processor has 1+ things like that which it can do that nothing else can. That’s part of what makes audio processing so much fun.
[quote author=”michi95″]And obvious Leif is so busy that we have to be patient.[/quote]
Yep, he’s very busy with more than just consumer Breakaway. Plus somewhere in the middle he actually has a life. =) He’s not easy to get a hold of, even on the "secured sub-space channel". hehe.The new Zenith is even better for broadcasting, without changing the sound in an undesirable way for the original goals I had for that, my 1st Breakaway preset. So make sure you’re using one of the current betas listed in the sticky topics on the top of this forum. 🙂
That being said… I soooooooo can’t wait for you guys to hear Passive Aggressor. It’s sort of like this nice slow completely open sounding preset, but the loudness and spectral balance is almost totally based on density. Sort of like the easiest to listen to very dynamic old-school processing, set as slow (or even slower) that you could ever do, and not only having it always doing the perfect balance based on the loudness of the spectrum areas… but having it also be able to eat transients in a very fast yet musical way, only when it’s really really needed.
Really, it sounds more open than Reference. 😀 The one thing that stands out in my mind when I listen to it, is that it’s very enjoyable and very easy to listen to. It’s my favorite preset and my favorite processing sound I’ve ever heard. Bar none. I hope you will enjoy it.
Some of the presets that have been removed, and are accessible by altering Breakaway’s INI file, were relatively low in treble. Like my wonderful Rusticity ’73 preset that almost nobody voted for which is why it was removed.
Personally I would make the preset dropdown scrollable, so that nothing has to be removed, but the new framework changes everything. Looking to the future. 🙂
I agree with the need for a treble adjustment after the multiband and before the final… whatever. 😉 Leif does too, so we’ll see what comes with the products made from the new framework.
When you guys see what is possible with that, you’re going to flip your wig. It’s so seriously cool, and I can’t tell you like 99.9% of it which sucks. But the time will come. 8)
