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Greetings Everyone!
First and foremost, I gotta say this: this Breakaway software = kickass! I recently just got my first pair of "real cans" (Audio Technica ATH A700), and those combined w/ this software has completely redefined my music/sound listening experience! Your software has brought out all the finer qualities these pair of cans can dish out and do, and I think it fortunate I happen across your software!
That said, and praises out of the way (*grin*), I’ve a question to help clear up some confusion on my end:
In the Breakaway software "Settings" section, under INPUT >> Rate (Default: 44100) can be increased to 48000.
Now, my OUTPUT source is defaulted to 48000. So, wouldn’t I want to increase my INPUT RATE to match that?
Are there pros/cons to either choice?
Here is my rig (Yes, I’m using my Motherboard default RealTek HD Audio for original source):
OS: MS Windows 7 (64-bit) | HD: 2x Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB
MB: Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD4P LGA 1366 ATX Intel Motherboard
CPU: Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem Quad-Core 2.66GHz LGA 1366
GPU: EVGA GeForce GTX 260 Core 216 (OC) 896MB 448-bit GDDR3
RAM: G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM 1600 (PC3 12800) Tri-Channel
HEADPHONES: Audio Technica ATH A700Howdy!
There’s a simple answer:
Most consumer sound cards (including on-board) perform best at 48000hz (or ONLY at 48000hz). However, most music is distributed at 44100hz (CDs).
The conversion has to happen somewhere — the question is where. In the sound card driver, in windows audio back-end, in the player, or elsewhere. Breakaway’s sample rate converter is cleaner than any of the aforementioned ones, which is why 44100 input and 48000hz output is the default in Breakaway, so that Breakaway gets to do the conversion. 🙂
///Leif
Right, but my question is:
Do I increase (where the arrow is pointing to in the picture below) this from 44100 to 48000, or leave it alone? More specifically, if I raise it from 44100 to 48000, am I essentially increasing the quality of sound I will hear?
I understand exactly what you mean — that IS the question I answered! Please read the response carefully. Which part are you confused about?
///Leif
*rereads two more times….light bulb!* OHH!
*coughs and clears throat* My bad! Ha! So you did….so you did 😆
hmm….well, as u stated (which i had previously misread):
quote :“Breakaway’s sample rate converter is cleaner than any of the aforementioned ones, which is why 44100 input and 48000hz output is the default in Breakaway, so that Breakaway gets to do the conversion.”Key info here is: INPUT @ 44100hz and OUTPUT @ 48000hz so BREAKAWAY handles the conversion, which insures the highest quality of listening experience currently obtainable through uses of this software.
All else is futile and inferior 😈 ((Ok, no more positive feedback for u for now unless I’m getting paid to officially endorse this product…which will not happen for a # of reasons, one of them being I’m of no notable worth for starters ….hahhaha 😆 ))
To add another element to this for streaming…. If I leave defaults as is in 44100 out 48000 (changing both to 2 channels)… would I also set the edcast cfg file’s LiveInSampleRate setting to 48000 as well??
This setting would look like this:
Music from player @ 44100 (that’s what they are encoded at)
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Breakaway In Pipeline @44100
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| (conversion here)
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Breakaway Out to sb audigy @ 48000
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Edcast In from sb audigy @48000
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Edcast to encoder @48000
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| (conversion here??)
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Encoder to shoutcast @44100This seems to have 2 conversions one in ba and one in the encoder in edcast. I guess my question is twofold… Is this above diagram correct? Also, how do you keep the best quality and least conversions/most efficient transfer of clean audio?
I could change the encoder in edcast to send out at 48000, but i may loose some compatibility.
Help me here music whizzes… (I know JesseG has his own opinions, which I greatly respect and value. I’m looking for more opinions here)
Thanks!
So to answer my own question… If I leave edcast’s setting to 44100…
Player Out to Pipeline (44100)
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Breakaway Pipeline In (44100)
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Breakaway Out Audigy (44100)
/ (conversion here on audigy??)
Edcast In Audigy (44100)
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Edcast Out Encoder (44100)
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Encoder Out Shoutcast (44100)This looks cleaner as there are less conversions in the chain. If the source material was never 48000, I guess the earlier theory is that breakaway is being nice to the audigy by feeding it audio at it’s native speed and handling that conversion internally. But it would have to be converted back, eventually, as my stream runs at 44100. This is JesseG’s method, btw.
I agree that for streaming it’s best to keep everything at 44100. That way, anyone listening to the stream will receive it at the same sampling rate as if he had played the tracks himself. If the listener has a sound card that performs poorly at 44100, it will still sound no worse than him playing music himself.
///Leif
So, the question is… Should I stream at 48000? If most of the world’s consumer-level soundcards are kickin at 48000 anyway, does it make sense or since the "industry standard" is 44100, should I keep it there? Perhaps there are apps or hardware that can’t playback a 48000 stream…
I would have to answer no to 48kHz. For starters… iTunes. It has a "resampler" built into it which is REALLY bad… actually, all it’s doing is inserting or removing values with NO filtering. Yeah… it’s that bad. Well it’s defaulted to 44kHz, so… for that alone I would say it’s a good idea to keep it at 44kHz.
But also there will be reduced quality perceptively at low bitrates, when you increase sample rate, with the currently available "mainstream" lossy codecs. An example would be running 64kbps stereo mp3… one at 44kHz and one at 32kHz. The 32kHz one should end up sounding better unless something is really wrong with the filtering used in the DAC (aka soundcard).
So yeah, it’s best to keep it at 44kHz. If your encoder needs to downsample for whatever settings you’re using, let that happen on its own too. Encoders generally have good resampling.
Jesse, you said something that peaked my curiosity… I have tried a 96kbps MP3 stream and while sounding loads better then say 32kbps or 64kps, it has a lot of wavering like on guitar strums and then some artifacting, which I expect some… You mentioned about using 32,000 instead of 44,100 on lower bitrate streams and while I wouldn’t think 96kbps is a lower bitrate, would I see any more musical stability if I did use 32,000 vs.44,100? Or is the bitrate too high and I would be losing definition/clarity?
Thanks!
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