Home › Forums › Breakaway Professional Products – [discontinued] › New system – scaling/hardware questions
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March 2, 2010 at 9:59 pm #727kthelenMember
Hello all!
Over the past few months I’ve been playing around with BBP on an AM/FM combo I take care of. I’ve been very impressed… so much so, in fact, that I’m looking at putting together some more permanent hardware and switching said stations over to BBP full-time.
Right now I’m running two machines, one for each station. Both are HP/Compaq D510’s – 2.8GHz P4, 512MB RAM, Windows XP Pro (pared down as much as possible), with the audio being handled by their rather unimpressive on-board audio codecs. The one feeding the AM runs in mono, and sits at around 60-70% processor load IIRC; while the FM one puts out full MPX stereo and seems to run up in the 90% range most of the time.
I’m no expert when it comes to multiprocessing, but am I safe to assume that the machine I dug up this afternoon – a DL380 with dual 2.8GHz P4’s and 1GB of RAM – should be able to handle the load of two BBP instances configured as above?
For obvious reasons, I’m also pretty much set on getting a new sound card for this project. I’ve checked out the Juli@ boards, and it seems that one of them would satisfy my needs – I need 3 in and 3 out, they do 4×4. Would this be a good bet for my situation?
On a related note, I’m also looking forward to testing BBP ASIO once I get my hands on some "real" audio hardware (the AM is automated and thus not very latency-sensitive, but the FM is live and I’d prefer to have the talent monitor off-air if possible). Would it be advisable, or even possible, to run BBP ASIO on the setup I’ve described? How much latency might I expect in such a scenario?
Hopefully all goes well with this, and these stations actually end up making the switch to BBP. I’ve been itching to get this on the air so I have a "test case" to hold up for other, less adventurous clients to be amazed by. Especially if BBP ASIO delivers the kind of low latency I’m hoping for, there may be more BBP conversions in my future 😀
–Keith
March 2, 2010 at 10:42 pm #10071yorkie98Participantquote :I’m no expert when it comes to multiprocessing, but am I safe to assume that the machine I dug up this afternoon – a DL380 with dual 2.8GHz P4’s and 1GB of RAM – should be able to handle the load of two BBP instances configured as above?I’d never assume anything, the only way to know is to try it. In my opinion 90% continuous CPU load is too high for a continuous operation, it will only result in severly shortened system lifespan. I make systems for BBP and even using the modern Dual-core Celerons (E1500 or E3300 for example), get about 35% CPU useage with a single instance. Using even a low end non-celeron dual core (such as an E5300 or E5400) brings this down to around 25%, much more comfortable for my tastes.
1Gb of ram should be adequate (although I always build with 2Gb, as windows get more and more bloated with every update). BBP has quite a low memory footprint of around 140Mb (per instance), considering what it does.quote :For obvious reasons, I’m also pretty much set on getting a new sound card for this project. I’ve checked out the Juli@ boards, and it seems that one of them would satisfy my needs – I need 3 in and 3 out, they do 4×4. Would this be a good bet for my situation?It should be ok, but please explain in more detail what each of the 3 outs are intended to be for.
quote :On a related note, I’m also looking forward to testing BBP ASIO once I get my hands on some “real” audio hardware (the AM is automated and thus not very latency-sensitive, but the FM is live and I’d prefer to have the talent monitor off-air if possible). Would it be advisable, or even possible, to run BBP ASIO on the setup I’ve described? How much latency might I expect in such a scenario?For the same reasons outlined above, you would need a better spec of machine to run this than you 2×2.8Ghz box, especially the ASIO version as this will place more demands upon the system and be a great deal less forgiving in the event of any kind of underruns. Exact minimum and recommecnded system specs are published on the main website.
I believe the latency can be as low as 17ms (from memory) but lower latency is always to the cost of quality to a certain degree.
Hope this helps,
Yorkie
March 2, 2010 at 11:20 pm #10072kthelenMember[quote author=”yorkie98″]It should be ok, but please explain in more detail what each of the 3 outs are intended to be for.[/quote]
The AM program is mono (1), and the the FM is stereo (2 – left and right). So I dashed down "3 in, 3 out."
But re-reading my post, I realized my mistake – MPX only requires one output. So it should be 3 in, 2 out 😕[quote author=”yorkie98″]For the same reasons outlined above, you would need a better spec of machine to run this than you 2×2.8Ghz box, especially the ASIO version as this will place more demands upon the system and be a great deal less forgiving in the event of any kind of underruns. Exact minimum and recommecnded system specs are published on the main website.[/quote]
I had a feeling someone might say that. Guess I’ll just have to test and see then… but from the sound of things, perhaps the dual 2.8 box won’t be as much a candidate as I’d hoped.
I’ve had a long-held (and possibly irrational) opposition to "white box" machines since dealing with lots of crummy ones in years past… but then again, I can’t exactly afford to plop down a couple grand for an otherwise similar name-brand machine. That said, what sort of machines (or processor/board/case combos) do you use? And would you have any suggestions for my application? I’d prefer something that I can rack up with the rest of the gear, but nothing’s set in stone.
March 3, 2010 at 12:28 am #10073yorkie98ParticipantRackmount PC cases are not hard to obtain, you’ll typically need a 4U case to accomodate a PCI card vertically (without risers etc..).
With regards to the Processor/Motherboard/Ram/HD etc, that’s really all down to budget and how far you can afford to go.
The Ultimate machine (which I have never and probably never will build) would be a quad core processor in a real decent motherboard, I like MSI or gigabyte boards myself but there are plenty of reviews going for any board, just do your research. You’d use a Solid state hard drive and install a nice slim install of XP Pro SP3. You’d also have plenty of cooling in there to keep all the parts content. Soundcard wise you would use a Marian Trace Alpha, there is NO better card for BBP.In reality, most of the systems are build to a budget (and leaving as much margin in there for myself as well) and the exact parts I use are often dictated by what’s available at the supplier.
With regards to your Juli@ card (if you havent bought it yet, do STRONGLY consider a Marian Trace Alpha, you will be so glad you did), the AM input, although mono would still be fed into one stereo pair of the card (just in mono) and the FM audio would be going into the second. This is assuming that these are two seperate stations or audio feeds and not simply a simulcast on FM and AM, if it’s a simulcast, then you only need to connect the audio once and both instances can pick up the audio from the same input, BBP can then be switched (digitally) to sum the L/R audio for the AM instance and use the same audio for the FM instance, this time not summing the input thus keeping it stereo.
The outputs of each instance can either be sent to seperate outputs on the soundcard (if available) or can even be set so that the FM instance sends its MPX signal out of (for example) the left channel and the AM instance sends it’s mono output out on the right channel. This configuration would work equally well on a multi-output card or a single output card as we are able to split the L and R of the card and each channel can carry an independant output, this can even be used to process and output two totally different stations on the one single output soundcard.
Yorkie.
March 4, 2010 at 12:59 pm #10074AnonymousGuestThe dual 2.8 P4 isn’t such a bad idea, but i have a little mention to make. It’ll run HOT. And Pentium 4s like to do something when they get hot – they THROTTLE. Aka they slow down, usually enough to completely screw up anything important you were doing.
Put a serious load on the machine with IntelBurnTest and monitor with ThrottleWatch. If you see any throttling going on you need to upgrade the cooling before you think of any serious use for it. Honestly, i wouldn’t bother with it, since even the cheapest LGA775 celeron (not even dual core, since it’s child’s play to overclock the single core ones to over 4GHz on any half-decent board) will walk all over it.
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